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Welcome to the Never Been Promoted podcast, where we're all about helping you cut the tie to all that holds you back. The excuses, the fears, the people, that sense of entitlement. Cut the ties so you can unleash your inner entrepreneur. Your host, Thomas Helfrich, is on a mission to make more entrepreneurs in the world and make them better at entrepreneurship.
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Hey. Welcome to Never Been Promoted. I'm your host, Thomas Helfrich. Appreciate you guys jumping in here today in our live show. If you're listening later on, thanks for listening. Appreciate it. We're gonna be talking about how to use podcasting, believe it or not, with, entrepreneurial growth. Like, it's a key factor. It's gonna be a massive part of SEO in the future, and you see tons and tons of people trying to figure it out and struggling. And, Jeremy Ryan Slate is our guest today. He is the founder of Commander Brand and a few other things. You're gonna learn so much about podcasting and the power of it. You're gonna be blown away with with what he does and and just and I can talk from personal experience. We've leveraged their their services today, in the past. So I I'm speaking firsthand. These guys know what they're doing. So before we bring Jeremy on, one shameless plug is to go to youtube.com and subscribe at never been promoted. And if you're listening to the podcast, 2 seconds is all it really takes. Do do the 5 star review. Anything less, you contact me and tell me why you don't think it's 5 5 stars, and we'll do what we can to fix it. Enough. Shameless plugs, mister Jeremy Ryan Slate.
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Get your booty to the stage, sir. How are you? Hey, man. I'm doing great. I was watching that that trailer. I think we need to buy you some sharper scissors.
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Right. Did you know metaphorically it's also a lot more difficult to cut a tie than you think?
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Do you see how that works? I feel like it would be
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pretty easy with the right pair of, kitchen shears. Right. With the right tools, it's easier and cleaner. Also, with guns like you do, that that vein is just intimidating. I don't know if you guys know this. If you're not list you're not watching, Jeremy can bench press an entire
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house. That's definitely not true.
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Okay. Fine. He can deadlift an entire house. He can bench press the roof.
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I I've deadlifted a car, but I don't know about, like, deadlifting a house. That seems like a how would you do that?
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Just the equivalent weight. My point is he's strong, like, stupid strong. I sent you sometimes on Instagram, I'll I'll take a picture of me lifting fives and be, like, suck it, Jeremy Ryans.
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I think they get they get washed. No. You usually, like, comment on my videos and be,
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like, puny. Like, you like, that that's just the kind of comments I get from you. Yeah. Everyone's, like, damn, dude. That's awesome. Like, put another plate there, Antonio. Oh, you're weird. My feet is infected with the guy that shows up as a janitor. You seem to The one that's always dead lifting and, like, then he's, like, in janitor's clothes, but he's actually, like, a pro power lifter. Right. And he's, like, he looks like he's, like, a £130 wet, and he's, like, lifting, like, things that these dude giant steroid dudes are, like, you can't lift that man. He's, like, let me just add on a couple more plates. These are fake. Right? It was awesome. By the way, guys, so, Jeremy, before you introduce yourself, I just want you to know you have the finest mustache in the game. 100% number 1.
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It is it was a commitment. It has literally changed my life. I was not relevant until I got the mustache, and now, like, I've been talking about the Roman Empire for the past year, and I've done all these big shows. I'm gonna I'm gonna be honest with you, man. The reason I grew the mustache, is I'm like, shoot. I'm going all these, like, larger shows talking about the Roman Empire. Like, I have to look like I'm old enough to know what I'm talking about, because I literally am 12 without a mustache. I didn't even think about that. That's a good point. Well, no. Like, let's think about it. Like, if you're professorial or you kinda have that, like, that look, you have to actually know, like, you're got some life experience, man. That's true. I mean, you know, just You got you got to dress for dress for the job you want, man. That's true. I,
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ironically, by the way, with my cut tie, I never wore ties in in job, and now I wear them all the time, which is, I think, kind of ironic. I don't know what what I mean. Just alright. Listen. Do you wanna set it up? Do you wanna you wanna first introduce the the few things you really kind of focused on? Congratulate. The way new website looks amazing, by the way. The only I'm missing from your scrolling podcast is ours. So we'll we'll talk about that, why that's not on there. But, the the, do you wanna talk about what you're doing today and back up far enough to kinda how you got there. Set us up with the, the kind of journey story. Yeah. Well, how how long you got, man? Oh, it's it's up to you. It's your show.
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Well, I guess, for me, you know, as I mentioned, my my master's degree, believe it or not, is in the Roman Empire. I studied why do people worship the emperor Augustus. I found it extremely interesting. When I got out of school, nobody else did. So you come out and you have a a useless piece of paper that now you have to pay a lot of money for that you just got. And I actually ended up teaching, in a private school for a couple years. I taught in a Catholic school. And, the inner city school next to it had just closed. And, I grew up in, like, the way country, so I'm not prepared to, like, handle myself in an inner city. When I go into New York, like, that's that's considered a day. So what ended up happening is we had basically these kind of really rich preppy kids, and then, you know, the inner city kids came in, and these two camps had me for lunch, man, because I believe I was, like, 20 years old, teaching them. And I actually had, like, people that work with me, didn't realize I worked with them and tried to give me detention for being out of uniform. It was a it was a little bit crazy. So I got burnt out really, really fast in about 2 years. And, in 2012, my mom ended up having a a really bad stroke, and she's still super disabled to this day. Like, she's lost her language skills, the use of the right side of her body, and it was really hard, man. It was definitely one of the hardest things I've been through, and it made me look at a lot of what I was doing in my life. And, like, dude, you you could have convinced me that it was profitable to sell garbage on Etsy, and I would have tried it at that point in time because I just wanted to do something something different, which actually I think is a career now. I think people actually do that. But anyway, I tried network marketing. I tried online marketing. I sold life insurance, which I was actually really good at. I just hated those conversations about, like, so you're going to die. And, you wouldn't want anything to happen to your family. Right? Because you love your you feel like I would like a like a mafia like, consigliere
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every time you're sitting down with someone like that. That with a Sarah McLaughlin song every time. You just, like, hold on. Let me key this up. Will you remember
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me? Exactly like that. Really heavy handed with some music in the background. Big fire. Yeah. That was it's a rough career, man. Like, I made some good money doing it, and I I definitely helped some people along the way. But I you gotta be a special type of person to do that, and, I don't know, man. I Your name is I don't You you can't do that. Empaths can't do that. No. I'm not an empath. I they I'm actually the opposite. I don't care enough, if that makes sense. Oh, that would be I'm kinda like so, like, for me, it's like you gotta kind of, like, wear a set of skills and things that you just don't have, and it isn't you. Like, you know what I mean? Like, I'm kinda like, what do you mean you can't do that? Come on. Get over it. Let's do it. Like, you know what I mean? Oh, you're bleeding. Who cares? Whatever. You're bleeding. You know, like, you know, put some put some milk on. So for me, I just wasn't good in a career like that. So I ended up starting this company back in in 2016. Well, because I started a podcast first in 2015, and it took off, man. We had a we had 10,000 downloads in our 1st month, and I talked to a lot of people I really admired. And, from there, people started asking for help and and Command Your Brand, which is originally called Get Featured Media, started in 2016.
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Yeah. You're, and Command Your Brand is a it's a I I think you labeled as a PR agency. It's how it's it's getting getting relevant people on the right podcast that have, like, the right exposure. Yeah. And because you're you're you got Fidelity. If you guys don't know this, I'm gonna do this pitch a little bit. You you hear that. Right? You get Fidelity, which means you're on the show forever. Right? Unless you say something stupid, but, like, you're on the show forever. So people as they they have popular shows, they're going to find you. Your SEO is going to find you. And and secondly, you get you hit in one conversation potentially millions of listeners. You can and, like, for the price, you can't even buy advertising to become so targeted. So what you guys do is really, really good and really, really relevant. Thanks, man. The difference is, versus you versus others, is that you actually have personal relationships with these podcast hosts because you've been on them. You personally know these people, and you've met them, and you've built business relationships for almost a decade or more right behind it. Mhmm. That is the difference, in my opinion, what you guys do versus a 1000000 other agencies that are just like
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like, I get in my inbox. Hey. I got a great guest for you, and I've never met the agency. I'm like, well, here. Did they call you the wrong first name? You know, I I love you. I'm gonna do that. A lot of times. Hey, Anit. I'm like, hey. Insert hello. Insert first name here. I would love to be on insert first name here, where my favorite episode is insert show name here. So, like no. I I I definitely appreciate that. And I I I guess, for me, like, I'm somebody that I wear what I do if that makes sense. You know what I mean? Like, I'm I'm a product. It's a network marketing phrase. I'm a product of the product. Right? Like, I I I'm somebody that, you know, I use what I do. And I and even for the last year as I've been having all these conversation about the Roman Empire, the cool thing is it's brought in a whole different caliber and type of show we've been able to book our clients on now because we kinda use me as the ability to to get the contact and create the conversation, and now we have a new established contact we can book clients on. So it's it's kinda fun, man, to be able to to work on both sides of it. So take me through that. So I I get your I I was I was gonna ask you this today specifically because I've been I also follow your stuff on on social
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and poke the bear occasionally for fun. But, the but I see been doing the Roman Empire, and I I've never really interjected in there because I'm like I I'm I'm, like, I'm trying to decipher what the marketing angle is for what you're doing. I didn't realize you had the history. There's none. There there's no marketing angle whatsoever. Right. Guys, guys, I'm gonna give you entrepreneurs listening. That is the wrong way to do a podcast is not to have a monetization idea. Now you have something, though. It's getting you it gives you a new topic to go meet a whole bunch of new podcasts. Correct. Okay. So it's not I was I was like, man, how is he tying this in the Commander brand? I was like, what is he? Is he running for office soon? I was like, what is he? I have no desire to run for office.
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Politics is a trap, roughly. Red team, blue team does not work.
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We'll get you a a a tie that has lots of colors in.
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Oh, well, that's a the whole another political situation that we might not wanna get into. I didn't know. I mean, it's just I'm just gonna help you out here. However, your audience so what do you do with the so okay. You have Commander Brand. Yeah. You you, you you have another thing I think you'd put in there was command your your empire. So Commander Empire is how we've connected Commander Brand to me talking about the Roman Empire. It's a really it's a it's a great resource for anyone out there listening that wants to get attention online and, you know, get a a track motion and and, and do that. So Command Your Command Your Empire is actually a 100% free. If you wanna contact me, there's a way to do that over there, but we wanna help you realize how to use the new media in the PR world, and and we've just put together a great resource for that for all these people that have been listening to me yak about the Roman Empire, man. I mean, I well, I mean, it's super interesting. And and is you know, if you think about podcasting, I wanna tie it back to our title of how you use it from no growth. I think 1st and foremost,
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the business plan just simply is you're you're you're getting new contacts of new shows so you can give them value with better guests down the road. That's that's part of the strategy. Is is that probably correct? Yeah. It's it's it's 2 different sides. It's one of it is
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just shamelessly I love talking about the Roman Empire, and this is what I've done in private my entire life. And I'm like, wait, people care now? That's amazing. So that's that's one side of it. The other side of it is is also it's supply side for us. Right? Like, for we're always constantly trying to get our clients on better and bigger shows, and that's a really good way to bring them in is a really unique and cool conversation. Right? So that's been part of it as well. But there's also the the positioning of of me as a guest too. Right? Because, you know, as I do bigger conversations, bigger places that enhances not just my credibility, but the credibility of my company. And I think when you think about it, there's a lot of different things whether you're a business owner that you're considering, you know, in doing media placements. You know, like, sure, it could. I think oftentimes what what people are thinking, Thomas, is they're like, okay. Well, how many leads did I get from this conversation? And I think for many people, that's the wrong way to go about it. It's, you know, what positioning did I achieve? You know, what people did I connect with? And and how did I grow my network or my influence? And that that's what this is all about, man. That's why it's I think podcasting really essentially is a great PR strategy.
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It is. And and, I try to find these little nuggets along the way for people who are listening. So one thing I would say is if you're just first starting out and you you can challenge us if you if you otherwise, get the problem you solve, get out there, start ringing the cash register to solve that problem. Yes. Like and just repeat that and refine it. Yes. Yeah. Because I think there's a lot of people that put the cart before the horse. People that put the cart before the horse. They, like, wanna get all the attention for the thing that doesn't make money yet, and it's, like, get a great quality business where you have a viable final product people are exchanging money for. But continue, man. Well, no. No. That's it. Because the truth is if so this is where people go wrong. They hire marketing agencies, do all kinds of things, email, like, that that aren't relying around just ringing that cash register. There's no proof of concept. Exactly. And you're also a shitty guest at that point too, just to be fair. You are because you don't you can't you haven't practiced enough. And and one thing you guys probably don't realize when you when you kinda work with Jeremy and his team, they put you on the show. They give you some feedback. You guys gave me some feedback. Hey. Super knowledgeable. Came across sales. You might, oh, I didn't realize that. Thank you. Probably should cut your tie in half. Right. Like, no. That's my own brand. I was bored one day. You you don't get credit for that one. That's mine. Take it. Bye. He told me I need a better tie. Anyway, the point is you you you are a shitty guest at that point. And then what I mean by that is you don't have the smoothest typically of your own story and what you're solving for the world to tie it to a relevant thing without sounding pitchy. And so when I first used you guys, I was a little too early probably because, I was trying to get brand awareness, understanding that game was like, that's where we wanna be. I'd be a much better customer now because I'd be like, hey. I've I've touched touched a 1,000 entrepreneurs now. When we and and so you're you're wasting your money a little bit. Don't touch a 1,000 entrepreneurs. There's legal there's legal ramifications to that. I have touched them. I mean, like, digitally. It's good. Real deep. And I'm a go sexy voice guy now. I mean, sometimes you gotta touch an entrepreneur to really get to know them deep. How deep is too deep? I don't think it exists. You can't bottom out. Terrified. You're gonna help me figure out how to make that that part. That podcast, by the way, you guys don't know this. If you if you catch this right now, Sexy Voice Guy is actually a podcast I have, and it's my experimental place. Right? Is do stupid 3 minute shows on humor of, like, you know, how to trim your bushes before those friends come over because you don't want them around the back door. It's dirty back there. Shit's everywhere.
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Oh, no.
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Anyway, that's not what you do, though. No. No. I don't. Definitely don't do that. So the point is when you're on your journey, use this at the right moment. Yes. When do you think is the right moment when someone should, you know and and I guess, two things. One's the right moment, and what what are they what is that entrepreneur currently what are their choices are they thinking at this point, and why they should pick this one and say over something else? So I guess
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most people aren't gonna like my answer because I think, you definitely should always be doing some sort of public relations. Right? Because you gotta get people to know you, like, and trust you. But I think for a lot of people, they have this certain idea of the caliber of a podcast they wanna go on. And if you don't have the stats or achievements to match up with that, like, ain't nobody that can get that for you. And I think that's you have to understand, because it's the match of your credibility and your achievements with somebody having the right connections and ability to do it for you. So I think that's one part of it. Now, I will say though for most people, if you're not doing this for vanity, and you're just like, hey, you know, I I need to get it in front of the right market and have the right conversations, and you're actually niching down in the show as you're going on. I would say, you know, like Thomas said, it's after that point you have some proof of concept. It's after that sign you're profitable. Like, you shouldn't be going on podcast if you're, like, I have to get a dollar out of this or I'm gonna die. The point is you wanna be getting more people to trust you to help your marketing convert better and to also help more people understand what you do. Right? So you kinda have to be past the critical mass point. You shouldn't expect podcast to be your critical mass, because it's really about getting that mission out there and helping other people and and and kind of making a bigger impact. It's not a sales machine. But if you're in the right position, it can enhance your ability and kind of jump you to the next level faster than anything you had ever done before. So I think it's really understanding, like, okay, we've we've got a profitable business. You know, we're we're in the high six figures now at this point. We we've got a decent sized team. Let's go on the right niche podcast, and let's really make an impact here because then you are talking to the right market. But I think for a lot of people, like, dude, you just gotta spend some time learning how to make money. I think that is a really, really important thing because you have to also have value to the end user. You know? Well, it it it's I just released you know,
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it's funny. So we have a really good YouTube channel going. Right? We haven't done actually any really YouTube videos. We were just a video podcast. I think you and I are both on the same page. If you're getting into podcasting and you are a podcaster and you're not on YouTube, you need to get on. You're missing a giant opportunity to get ahead of a curve on something because they're they're gonna compete head to head with Apple and, I think, beat them because they don't only have Android users. They have all the Apple users too. So they have everybody. Anyway, that being said, you know, we we you get out there. You make your podcast, you you build it up, you you you you do the things you do. But to get on the shows, to add value, you you've talked about being able to ring that register. Right? So the thing that we had just created was, like, hey, stop raising funds, raise hell. Right? Like, get out there and start ringing that. Like, 99% of people are never gonna raise money. It's outside of grandma and friends. So take that money and go, but then forget it. I believe once you do, if you don't know specifically, you need to be on the 7 marketing podcasts because you have a new digital tool that does something for marketers. Until you know that, you don't know which podcast or who you should even talk to or what you should be saying as opposed to understanding their problems. That's right. A lot. You just gotta get the right audience and let them hear you a few times. Yeah. And that's correctly. Because I think for most people, like, when they're not in that position,
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they wanna be on the podcast with my perfect audience, with their checkbook at do people sue the checks, like, with their their Bitcoin wallets out? I don't know. Whatever it is where somebody's ready to pay right away. And they just you know, if I get in front of this many people, this people will buy, whatever it is. Like, this isn't an ad. And I think that's what you really need to understand is you're trying to create a caliber type of show and a and a reaction from a show that doesn't exist. You need to be at a point where you like, you need to sell more, man. And and a lot of times that's I remember when I when I started, the company as ran before this one, like, dude, I was doing door to door sales for personal training, because I knew that's what worked, and I knew that was how I can get in front of more people. To achieve critical mass, it's a sales problem for most people. You need to get in front of more people, you need to make more sales, and a lot of times, you gotta make them yourself, so you understand the end user. Yep. And you get to a certain point where, like, you have a business that's running and it starts to run without you a bit. Well, now you, the founder, have some time. So I think also you'll see companies that, maybe they are at a at a next level and they'll try to take a c suite executive and stick them on podcast to represent the company, and that's also a really bad idea because that person doesn't have the brand story and doesn't have something that the company is tied to. So I think it's very important that the person doing interviews is the person that started the thing. It's I think it's vital. But you need to be in a in a position where and we see this with a lot of lot of doctors actually. We work with a lot of, holistic and functional practitioners, where if you have to be in your office 9 to 5 doing inner seeing patients, this is not gonna be a good situation, because you're not gonna have enough time open your schedule to do podcasts. So it it really creates this thing of okay. So maybe you're seeing patients 2 days a week. Right? Because now you have somebody else in your office that's helping with that. But you've gotta get to the point where this thing is profitable enough. You've got a little bit of time, so now you can start to do things where you represent your brand.
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And and and I think this ties to, so so let's go back to where I see. You ring the cash register. You you have us, you know And I appreciate you mentioning that, by the way, because not a lot of people mention what you're saying right now about ringing the cash register. You have to do that. You have to make money first and understand what you solve. And don't get too thin. Don't do so you you're starting to make money. You know, you've gone from, like, a few $100 to a few 1,000. Now you're repeating it. Now you're like, okay. Look. I've I've just crossed my w two income, and I think we're gonna keep doing it. Then you're gonna get into the spot of ancillary marketing that goes outside of sales, which allows you to to raise your executive imminence, your personal brand, your, when people search for you, you check out. So when the people check you out, you check out. This is where this stuff starts. It's the next layer out. Yes. And and some people think it's further out. I don't I actually think this is one of the next layers. And I think that is when you write a book, and this is when you start writing more content. This is when you start saying you start talking and showing your thought authority on it or whatever you wanna call it. I know it's the right word or not, but it's this is where this exists. But it cannot be one thing you're doing. So where you're marketing and tight to sell, that could be one thing. Facebook ads, it's crushing. We repeat it, whatever it is. This is when you start getting out, you're gonna need multichannel. So I think podcasting is one of it. I think getting on, doing YouTube or some kind of video or writing articles on medium, you need a few things to start doing the personal brand and the shaping around that. In my opinion, I think this is one of them. And you you do have to start with 1, but I do think starting with podcasting gives you the biggest exposure quickly and then leveraging those conversations to do the second thing, which could be like the writing. I was on this podcast, and then you're giving them attention. So so talk about, like, that ancillary, that second layer of marketing that helps you go. And then then I wanna dive into what you do for the podcasters once you go on there, because I think this is this thing that people miss all the time. So what do you think about that from, like what do they tie it with? Like, because it can't just be by the only thing they're doing. Well, I think that's a really important point too because, you know, this goes back to putting the the cart before the horse like we talked about a few a few minutes ago. Because I think and
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I'm sorry to the coaches out there that do a good job and help people, but I think there's a large percentage of coaches on Instagram, especially, that have kind of changed how people look at this. There's a a kind of a layer of people that wanna make money off being famous for being famous. Right? Like, okay. So I'll get really well known, and then people will pay me to coach them or pay me to consult them or whatever it might be, and that is so bass acwards, man. It is it is basically getting yourself to a point where, you know, now you need to get the message out there and get people to understand it better. Right? Like you started selling, you started making things move, but now you're kind of hitting this barrier. This barrier is that maybe enough people don't understand what you do. Right? So you're not gonna be able to get past that kind of that that plateau unless you educate better. And I think you're talking about writing a book and and being on podcast, that's where that falls in Because you're taking people that should be your protect prospective customer that maybe have an awareness of who you are or have an a slight understanding of what you do, but you're actually taking them and giving them some education now. So they're becoming not just a better prospect, but a better referral source or better information source. Right? I've referred a lot of products to people that I've heard on podcast because I understand how they work better. And I think that's what you really have to consider as you get to that point where now, okay, we've made some money, you know, the lights are not gonna go off if I don't sell anything today. But now we need to make sure that we get our mission out there better and get people to a level where they can understand we do better because we're gonna top out if we don't do that. It's you become an education company at certain point in in addition to a delivery company, if that makes sense. Exactly. And,
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and so I have a philosophy on social media that you should just you know, I know, like, Gary Vee says, you know, jab jab punch. I I that's too aggressive in my opinion because it's like you're you're you're asking people to buy from you every 3rd conversation. Anyway, the point of it is get out there and just give value and get your personal brand and stuff set up in a way that people come to you to buy.
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And you can do sales channels outside of that. But from a content standpoint, just give value. I I I don't Especially early on, man. Like, I think I think the the the the right process is probably, you know, 50 jabs and then a punch. Right? I I think that's what you're looking at because you really, really, really, really have to generate trust because that trust can be earned over a long period of time and it can be wasted so fast. So that's what you really have to understand and it's I think the thing is interesting as well, Thomas, is it's like you have to be much more thoughtful now with what the punch looks like because the consumer has changed so much. So if you punch in the wrong way, you can ruin everything. So I think it's also understanding that the nuance in how you how you do the asks and things like that.
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Agreed. And, the the that's good. How you punch matters. But, you know, but I will say, like but if you're doing, let's say, email marketing, for example, I'd rather just get one that says, hey. This is the value I provide. If if you're if you're in that spot in your life, you think you might need this, here's how to just kinda have the first conversation, and just send me one. I'm more likely to click on that than you were up for get it.
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Because we're in this this weird position right now where the consumer the consumer runs the understands the Internet really well, whereas 5, 10 years ago, you couldn't say that. So now, you know, they're kinda like, alright. I'm in your 7 day sequence. You know, when does the text message come? So you have to understand the consumer has gotten really intelligent now. So now it's about the level of quality of content you can provide them, and, frankly, I think it's also not overwhelming them as well. Like, we used to send daily emails. We don't do that anymore. We're about good quality pieces that people actually want to receive because everybody's doing that. We've gotten to the point where now you stand out by how you're doing something different because everybody's doing the same thing, and and the consumer has gotten very, very smart. You know, they've caught on to okay. So, you have a cookie timer on this page that says it's gonna expire in 30 seconds. But if I go in a different browser, then it's not gonna have the cookie, and I can just buy that thing anyway. So the the you you have the consumers gotten so intelligent Right. So they can kind of see through a lot of the BS. So it's you know, as a I know you're a marketing guy, so you probably have a word for this, but I don't I don't know what to call it. It's kind of almost like, you have to be really truthful in marketing now. Like, you have to be 100% truthful and authentic in marketing now. So my personal brand is so anti spam, Like like, so anti spam. We don't even email. We have we've collected emails for 4 years now. We've, I think, sent me 4
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total. And one was like, hey. We hit top 5% global podcast. If you could, like, you said you're on the show, you know, would you jump on there and just comment? And, like, it was like a 90 some percent open rate. We're like, alright. Cool. That was a good one. So, anyway, let's come back to podcast. Get with me in the marketing bit. Alright. So you you let's say you're on that spot. You're listening. Like, alright. What do I do? Give this is where I want you to take this 1 a 100%. Yeah. Go on a show. This is the stuff you should be doing and absolutely don't do either before and after, because there this is where you waste the the time and effort, and oftentimes, the the podcast host goes, god, what a dud. And they don't tell you that, but go through, take a few minutes, whatever you need to hear, to to do that with the do's and don'ts once you decide to go down the podcasting route. I think one part of it too is is not everyone should start a podcast.
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There there's people out there, like, you know, everybody should have a podcast. And I think that's kind of, like, that's bunk. I don't think everybody if anybody uses the word bunk. When you go on somebody else's here for sure. Well, no. I wanna I wanna kinda get the sequence here. Like, if you're gonna have a podcast, my recommendation is to actually even if you're gonna have a podcast, go on shows first, because you're gonna understand the guest better and you're gonna be a better host. So I think everyone should be starting with going on shows, and you may use some discernment of, like, okay, maybe I'm really good at this, maybe I'm terrible at this, maybe I can use some more practice, or maybe I just would be good at not hosting a show. So I think it the the discernment of it is important. But I think when you look at the shows, it's about getting in the right niche. So for example, we have a client now that they do financial management, but only for, like, veterinary offices. That is the the niches of niches, man. But so, like, they're very particular about what shows they go on. And you know what? Some of those shows might only have 300, 500 listeners. But I think often people are stuck on tens of thousands and hundreds of thousands and many times that's so that net is so wide you can't catch anyone. Right? Like, you can't bring anyone in or educate anyone. So I think first and foremost is understanding how niche you have to be. Number 2, it's understanding that podcasts are a teaching environment. You're there to teach someone how to do something really well in a short period of time. So, you know, don't get esoteric, don't use special words, keep it simple, realize that and this isn't to be offensive. Most people are on a 6th grade reading level. So you wanna keep things in a way that people can understand and can actually get something out of what you have to say because you wanna understand that education has 2 parts. It has the theory of it and the practice of it. So the theory of it is people listening to you, hopefully getting some steps and ideas and tips on how to do it, and then whatever you give away is the practical part. It gives them the actual steps to get that full win on what you were teaching. So as I mentioned, like for me, command you have it up and up on the screen now, Commander Empire. That's our practical. Here's the theory and the the way I look at it, but I want you to get some hands on experience. So you kind of kind of marry those 2 up. So when you're on a show, realize you are the information source, answer those questions to the best of your ability, don't make it a shameless pitch fest, but also realize you have 2 audiences when you're on a podcast. You have the show that's interviewing you, that host is an audience for you, and also the, people listening to you are also an audience for you, and I think that's vital as well because you could do some great networking with hosts, and I have. And I've done I've had done some had some incredible business and personal relationships with hosts. So you wanna kind of realize those few things. Also, I think people get really stuck on these, like, framework ideas. You know what I mean, Thomas? Like like, okay. So I'm gonna speak from stage, and my framework is this 3 part framework, and then we get ready for the pitch, and I've got a I've got a value stack, and we're ready to go. People try to take that and put it into a podcast, and it comes off as superficial, and it's not real, and it's not human. Podcasts are a conversation where people wanna feel like they're a fly on the wall and can learn something. I'm sorry to tell you that your format or your, you know, road map or framework doesn't work here. If you cannot be a real human being, it doesn't work. And I think, not to get too political on this, but I think if you look at, kind of the Republican presidential campaign over the last year, you have, Trump that went on a whole boatload of podcast, and you have DeSantis that wouldn't go on any. He went I think he went on 1 with Patrick Bet David, and it was a very, very guarded set up conversation for him. So it becomes difficult to see, like, is this a real person? Like, can I trust them? Do I know who they are? And I think to realize that's what podcasts are, you can't make them this super safe media space that people wanna have. You have to be willing to to be real and sometimes be flawed, man. Yeah. And just to just you know, I want you to keep going with these kind of advice pieces because these are beautiful nuggets.
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So if you've made it to this part in the show, good job. You're gonna you're getting the you're getting the juice now. Here it comes. Yep. I will tell you in our own, we you know, we start you start off with some kind of idea of a format. And what I found was I was people were so, like, wound up on the questions I was going to ask them and they get to the show. And by the time they got to the show, like, hey, we've already changed the format that just tell me about your story and your journey and then tell me how you helped the world today. And when you we did that, that created a conversation with 2 people having coffee versus question answer question answer, and it becomes very repetitive and boring. But I'd say start someplace, but understand if you're not having that conversation, when you're on someone's podcast, unless I will say with exception. I went on a top entrepreneur with Nathan Latka. It's like a 15 minute, and he his hits his Oh, and if you don't know your numbers, he's gonna have you for lunch, man. Right. And and and and the and I barely knew mine. But I'd also had never really done the research, and so do your research before you go on, but he nails it down, but he's also top of funnel. He's looking for companies to invest in or buy or whatever else. The point being is unless you're one of those podcasts that are like, hey. We hit it hard, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, and that's it, You're gonna have a conversation, so be prepared to have an actual conversation regardless if you host 1 or you're on somebody's. And I think the thing I think a lot of hosts don't do is they or a lot of you guess, they don't ask questions of the host. And those guys
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You know what's even wild, man? And this is something I've thought of doing more in person interviews that I haven't I didn't think of as much doing, like, virtual interviews, is also the aesthetic of the show. This is gonna sound like the aesthetic of the show. So, like, so I was on, Valuetainment, the the PBD network back in in May. You show up to their studio in a 3 piece suit because that's what you do. Right? I was on Tim Pool's show in March. You show up in a V neck t shirt. That's how you do it. The aesthetic of how you show up on a show actually really matters too. Sure. Because it it's how people see you, perceive you, and and whatever it might be. There's so many things that are important to understanding when you're a guest. You have to how you have to appear. Even, you know, not that you have to be the top expert in that show, but understanding, like, how they discuss topics is is pretty important because how you show up and discuss the topic is gonna change. Right. And so that it's it's super important to be prepared.
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It's something I know I've messed up on. I'm it's obvious sometimes when people come in our show, they don't realize what's like, haven't listened to anything. But they have. They're ready. I'm gonna tell my story, and I'm like, just don't ever be salesy, so I get it. So be prepared. Get ready to have a conversation. That is the best way to go on and host. You owe the show. It goes goes however it goes. What do you what should that person do next? The the guest. I mean, you're on someone else's show in particular that's bigger than you. Any show, but specifically those, what what should you be doing as the guest?
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I guess I don't understand the question, man. I mean, afterwards. So I'm leading the witness here that, hey. You need to go promote it and give him attention. But, a lot of people just go on the show. I didn't quite I didn't quite hear what you're saying. Yeah. That's right. So when you've gone on a show and, like like because what I've seen is I've seen people that I I I'm pretty sure you've gotten them on shows, and then I and I'll follow them, and they won't be doing nearly enough than personal sales after a show. Well, that this is actually a reason we ruled out we ruled out another service to, where we're doing reels and stuff for people as well because half to Because they won't do it. Because that was the biggest part that that that I saw, like, it's I'm gonna go back to this Roman Empire campaign, because I've learned so much about which is wild, man, because this is almost year 9 of what we've been doing this. And I've learned so much from this campaign, because I've never like, I've always had some motion, but I never had motion like this, like, it's been different. So what we've ended up doing is we've done a lot of reels and shorts and stuff like that, but also with b roll because that matters too, because it keeps the people's attention. You need to be promoting this stuff constantly. There's a few really great tools out there for this. My first favorite one is video dotai. It's a really really good tool for chopping things up, not just into, like, the short style, but also like the horizontal, like, segment style, which is nice too. So video dotai is a great tool for that. This script has some great tools too, because, like, let's say you're promoting something, and you're like, for me, this is a problem. Like, let's say, I said, 3rd century AD, and I should have said 2nd century AD. Well, now I look like a total doofus in something I'm promoting. So you can actually use Descript to change the voice tone so that you can say the right thing voice wise in that clip. I hope it does, like, a Spanish accent a second.
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I'm in the second here.
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Senorito Taco Bell. Yeah. So but that that's important. Right? So you want to make sure, like, the content you're promoting grabs eyes, and I'm telling you, man, the difference we've seen in posting just shorts and reels without b roll and sound sound effects is 10 x. Yeah. When we post reels with sound effects and and with with b roll, it's it's dramatic.
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What a what a software takes the the this kind of video and stacks it for you on portrait? So I there's one out there. I was hoping maybe, you know, if you don't know, it's fine. Like, we're we're side by side, 16 by 9. There's one that will go like this. Oh, video video AI will do that. Video AI is one of those. It'll do that, and it'll stack them. Because because that is, like so so one of the things we we you know, you don't wanna manually do that anymore. You can pull in b roll in that app too. Like, they have a a b roll library you can pull from. So video AI. I I will, personally see listen, I guys, this is the whole reason I started the show. And it's it's it's, vidyo.ai. I guess somebody already had, like, video.ai.
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So it's vidyo.ai.
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This I tell you, this is why I started the channel is because I didn't wanna pay for coaching. So I just bring people in for now or get them to come on and they sponsor their own show,
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and then I get to learn shit ton. It's great. Well, I'll tell you right now, you know, I for me, I haven't seen as much movement on TikTok as I like, because I guess I I say things that the Chinese government doesn't like. But, like, on Instagram, I've seen a lot of momentum, from there as well. And something we've done too, if you click on your follower number on Instagram, this little thing will come up that kinda looks like a caution sign, and you can actually remove spam followers. So that's something we're doing repeatedly because sometimes you'll get, like, spammy accounts that'll follow you and that affects your reach. Right? Like, if you have too many people that are kind of spammy accounts, then they'll kind of, like, you know, you won't see the engagement and stuff you should see. But we so I've we're continually doing that, but also, like, we see that a tool on Instagram or what's on It's on Instagram. Like, you you have to do it on the phone. You can't do it on the computer. Oh, so you got yeah. Yes. So you go, you open Instagram. You go to, your profile, and then it says on the top, your number of posts, your number of followers, your number of following. If you click on followers, like the number, it'll it'll say your follower number and then it'll bring up a little thing that says, looks like a caution sign that says spam followers. You can actually remove those from your account, and that'll help your engagement because you're removing and we do it constantly, right, because you might always get, like, new ones in or maybe somebody doesn't like you and they send bot followers at you. So, like, those are things that keep your engagement high too.
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Yeah. We, I think all my followers are bot followers. Oh, damn, man. No. I'm kidding. I don't know. My camera just got weird. I saw that. You just went sideways. I just it's like, what happened there? Technology's hard, people. Okay. We've covered some stuff here. I wanna be conscious of the time here too. Listen. Like, if so here's what I take away. If you're gonna be a go on podcasts Mhmm. Give get a hold of you, and they could do it through command your empire dot com or even command your brand dot com. But command your empire, there's a bunch of free stuff. That's a good spot start just to get to know you a little bit.
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I think I want people to get I want people to get that other side of learning. You know? As I said, we've talked a lot about theory and the reasons why you should do things, but go out there and get some some good experience. And if you feel like at the end of that, like, hey. You need some help? Like, great. We'd love to help you, but, like, I just want you to go out there and win, man.
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Well and and exactly. And and I know you're and I'm speaking from someone who's, like, you know, worked with you and known you guys for a while now. You're legit. And, like, you're not like, this is not a BS service. This is something, though, that you do invest in and you do use to per further a brand. I would tell you, don't get old Jeremy unless you guys are like listen. We're a established company. We're just trying to get out of this plateau. That's when you call you. Like, that's that's the time. If you're just starting,
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follow, watch, learn, go to Well, and we've got some great courses for that too. Like, so if you wanna check out our courses, we're we're glad to help you there. But, like, from a from an agency perspective, I don't wanna take your money unless I feel like I can get you the result that we're both looking to get you.
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Well, exactly. Because if you can't, then it doesn't help your brand. It doesn't help anyone's brand. Jeremy, thank you so much, by the way, coming on. Commander Empire.com. I'm gonna drop you into the, the periwinkle room. You rock. I love it. Thank you so much for coming on and taking a few minutes. I know you're super busy, so thanks for getting in here today. Hey, man. I appreciate you having me. And, also, like, at the same time, we've talked about this stuff in a way different perspective than I ever talk about on shows. This is actually more real, by the way. This is how I talk on a personal level, so thanks for having me on, man. I appreciate it. Jeremy, thank you so much, guys. If you made it to this point in the show, thank you. You rock. You're awesome. If, if you've, you know, never been here before and this is your first time here, thank you. Like, listen, I hope it's the first of many. We're on that mission to help millions of entrepreneurs get better at entrepreneurship by unleashing their entrepreneur. And, I'm on a mission personally to do this. This is something I wanna do for the rest of my life is help make more entrepreneurs in the world. I think our country needs it. I think the world needs it. You get an absolute economic advantage as a country to have people. And, also, half the people in the world hate their job, and they're not happy. So we wanna make sure that we get more people that are just generally happier. Till you meet again, get out there. I want you to go unleash your entrepreneur. Thank you so much for listening.
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Thank you for listening to the Never Been Promoted podcast. If you liked today's show, subscribe at youtube.com forward slash at never been promoted. Until next time. Get out there and go unleash your inner entrepreneur.